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[furryclan]  |  Single player and online games  |  SWAT3  |  Topic: Possible bug SCN Hacking 10.0 « previous next »
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Author Topic: Possible bug SCN Hacking 10.0  (Read 17196 times)
[Don_T_Shoot]
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Re: Possible bug SCN Hacking 10.0
« Reply #75 on: 2010-10-22 13:31:17 »

Interestingly, I have a jacket that is black, but is essentially the same as the one worn by "I'm a dinner jacket" in that photo.

Seekrit Muslim!!!!
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[GhostRider]
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Re: Possible bug SCN Hacking 10.0
« Reply #76 on: 2010-10-22 16:18:18 »

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Cpy-Ct
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Re: Possible bug SCN Hacking 10.0
« Reply #77 on: 2010-10-22 16:31:54 »

I have probably mentioned this before. the SCN_Hacking tool is awesome no doubt, for making changes to .scn (maps), such as lighting and adding entities when the RMF file is unavailable. but what if....

missiona.rmf

Created in June 29, 2010, back when I could have possibly up to this day, recreated all geometry to missions (a-z) in the game. I guess I have gotten lazy, no real motivation.

Someone tell me if it is worth completing, because of course, it is one of my unfinished projects.

I am f'n bored out my mind.
« Last Edit: 2010-10-22 16:34:14 by Cpy-Ct » Logged
[_PhoeniX_]
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Re: Possible bug SCN Hacking 10.0
« Reply #78 on: 2010-10-23 00:41:18 »

Interestingly, I have a jacket that is black, but is essentially the same as the one worn by "I'm a dinner jacket" in that photo.

Yo tambien.
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Slippery_Jim
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Re: Possible bug SCN Hacking 10.0
« Reply #79 on: 2010-10-23 15:40:16 »

Furrycat got a question about one of the features listed in the dox:

Quote
--force-colours:
  Some lights in the scene do not have a Color attribute.  In versions of
  scnhacking prior to 0.3, the default behaviour was to create if it was
  missing.  From 0.3 you must use --force-colours explicitly.
  This command was added in scnhacking version 0.3.

So really this command does the same as using the "--add-attribute" to add "color" ?    What colour gets assigned?

Should the syntax be:

Quote
--force-colours <light> <r> <g> <b>
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[furrycat]
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Re: Possible bug SCN Hacking 10.0
« Reply #80 on: 2010-10-23 15:56:34 »

I don't remember what the thinking was but that option is used in the replace_colour() function in the code so I would guess that it is used to override the sanity check for missing color fields when doing a --replace-colours.
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Slippery_Jim
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Re: Possible bug SCN Hacking 10.0
« Reply #81 on: 2010-10-23 22:28:31 »

One thing I noticed is that if you just type "scnhacking.exe" and then hit ENTER that there is a slight error in the information it provides about the functions/commands:

Quote
--replace-colours color r g b


This is what the README file states is proper syntax:

Quote
--replace-colours <light> <r> <g> <b>

Still also confused about proper syntax for --force-colours.
« Last Edit: 2010-10-23 22:34:28 by Slippery_Jim » Logged
AlienAbducter
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Re: Possible bug SCN Hacking 10.0
« Reply #82 on: 2010-11-01 00:34:49 »

I built a new version of the scn viewer with some UV remapping included (see readme inside). Also set up a project page on google code for it, so I don't loose motivation.

https://code.google.com/p/scnedit/

Check there for future versions.
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Slippery_Jim
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Re: Possible bug SCN Hacking 10.0
« Reply #83 on: 2010-11-01 01:13:43 »

Fantastic freaking news.   Been wishing for this release for over a year.

Unfortunately I am busy re-making the Swat 3 Last Resort website (we never made a full proper backup, lol).    I will test the new SCN Editor in a day or so.

Besides, Minecraft has me very, very distracted.

Thanks AA!
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[Longbow]
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Re: Possible bug SCN Hacking 10.0
« Reply #84 on: 2010-11-01 15:29:29 »

what is this Minecraft thing you speak of?
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Slippery_Jim
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Re: Possible bug SCN Hacking 10.0
« Reply #85 on: 2010-11-01 19:15:40 »

I blame [Furryclan] for getting me addicted.   I may even have to buy it.

Have you tried playing it in 3D?   Pretty cool stuff.
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Slippery_Jim
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Re: Possible bug SCN Hacking 10.0
« Reply #86 on: 2010-11-02 05:59:45 »

https://code.google.com/p/scnedit/

Check there for future versions.

Hey there AA.

I played with the SCN Editor and have some initial feedback.    No bugs spotted yet.  I hope to have more free time over next few days to really test it properly.

The google code website seems like it is only for reporting bugs and there doesn't seem to be a place for feedback or suggestions.   Hope you don't mind me being bold and posting here.


First impressions of the new features is that you have done some amazing work!   I am really impressed.  It is almost black magic.

- The command line options are a real nice addition.   I like being able to customize the screen resolution.
- The semi-transparent "-forcealpha" is an elegant way of dealing with those objects.  Brilliant stuff.
- The application handled the replacement hi-res textures perfectly.
- Old OpenGL gave me a FPS of about 29 and new DirectX support gives me around 50.   Nice improvement (not that speed really is a factor).

Some suggestions for future versions:

- Would love an undo feature when modifying the texture uv map.
- When you click a single surface would be great if we could see what the size ratio of the texture is. It is useful to be able to compare the numbers to ensure accuracy when working.  Right now the only way to tell if you have the right scale is a visual comparison.
- The controls are messing with my head a little.   I am used to using the WASD keys in games for movement (especially in Worldcraft).

Amazing work so far!
« Last Edit: 2010-11-02 06:35:10 by Slippery_Jim » Logged
AlienAbducter
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Re: Possible bug SCN Hacking 10.0
« Reply #87 on: 2010-11-02 10:27:15 »

Thanks for the feedback. I'll look into it!

Right now I'm also toying with the idea of exporting to .map format, for worldcraft. It would be an ugly hack and you wouldn't be able to compile the geometry again (there would be x6 the original ammount of polygons), but I think I could make it so you could import the entities at least, back into the .scn. This would mean editing and adding entities could be done in worldcraft,

Just because, you know, its fun!

Also, minecraft. Loved it.  Good thing I stopped playing it. The thing was taking away my sleep. I hear there's a new halloween version, though.
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Slippery_Jim
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Re: Possible bug SCN Hacking 10.0
« Reply #88 on: 2010-11-02 15:09:14 »

Right now I'm also toying with the idea of exporting to .map format, for worldcraft. It would be an ugly hack and you wouldn't be able to compile the geometry again (there would be x6 the original ammount of polygons), but I think I could make it so you could import the entities at least, back into the .scn. This would mean editing and adding entities could be done in worldcraft,

Hmm, interesting idea.    I thought of doing something similar using the --describe-all data from Furrycat's SCN Hacking utility.   The data it gives you about the entities could be converted into .map format if you are determined enough.   Of course this would only give you the entities that you could load into WC...not the geometry.

I was tempted to use it to help make a night version of all the day maps (and vice versa) but it was a lot of work for very little payoff.    The other problem is some of the geometry in a few maps is screwed up in terms of how it reacts to light.   For instance in Mission A there are several pieces of geometry that don't appear to react to the light map.  It is always bright no matter how dark you make the lights.    I tried hacking the SCN to ensure that every entity was set to cause (and receive) shadows but it didn't fix the issue.

In the end I gave up the idea of making the night/day maps.   I already had too much work on my plate.

UPDATE:  I did a bunch of texture adjustments with SCN Editor 0.4 in Mission A and all worked fine.   I replaced a few textures, and mostly did texture re-alignment on surfaces that weren't shared.  I also did a few scale (ratio) changes and all worked fine.   I stayed away from shared surfaces so far.


When you say that there are "weird artifacts" are you referring to the fact that on shared surfaces usually part of the texture goes all funky and stretched looking?   If so that is I assume because SCN Editor is trying to move/scale the textures all the same but the original map maker didn't always use the same numbers for each surface.

This leads to the question of how you deal with all the UV mapping features that are present in Worldcraft.   In WC's texture alignment tool there is Scale X and Y, Shift X and Y, Rotation angle, and World and Face tick boxes.   Can all that same data be eventually dealt with?


UPDATE 2:

Feature request:

- When you hit SAVE button SCN editor automatically increments the filename  ie missiona1.scn missiona2.scn etc   (this would prevent loss of work if a mistake happens or if we get artifacts from shared surfaces).

- I am thinking about using Copy-cat's lit actor technique to improve certain maps but I don't know where to add the entities.   Is there some way that SCN Editor could display the origin numbers of a surface?    For instance I want to add new high-res buildings across the street from the Import store.  Using a .GSM and a Lit Actor entity it is possible to add a new building but right now I have no idea where it would get placed in the map.  I would need the origin numbers as a start point so I could use SCN Hacking to add an entity.   Does something like that sound feasible?
« Last Edit: 2010-11-02 16:43:11 by Slippery_Jim » Logged
AlienAbducter
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Re: Possible bug SCN Hacking 10.0
« Reply #89 on: 2010-11-02 20:57:12 »

Hmm, I'm not sure I explained the shared surfaces thing properly. The ideia is that, to save memory in the .scn, UV positions are shared between vertices of different surfaces. So, two different surfaces can point to the same UV vertex, and if you edit one surface by, for instance, shifting up, it will strecht or otherwise deform the texture on the other surface. So, I think it's better to select all surfaces (until there are no blue left) and edit them all in bulk. This way they all move at the same time, and no wierd deformation.

Other solution would be to split the vertex and create a copy of it, so each surface only points to one instance, and they can be edited separately. I thought this wasn't worth the trouble, and shared surfaces are usually related anyway (like a long wall) and editing them all at the same time makes sense.

What I mean with wierd lighting artifacts is another thing (although I guess they can be related), and is what I guess can happen in swat3, if you mess with a texture too much in scnedit. I had it happen once but I'm too lazy to duplicate it.

Quote
This leads to the question of how you deal with all the UV mapping features that are present in Worldcraft.   In WC's texture alignment tool there is Scale X and Y, Shift X and Y, Rotation angle, and World and Face tick boxes.   Can all that same data be eventually dealt with?

I don't know if I could do a system like they do. I could look into adding rotation, but I don't think I'd be doing something as complete as that. Also, to tell the current texture ratio I think i'd have to think a little. Maybe?  PS: WC texturing always sucked.

Feel free to put feedback/suggestions/discussions in the issue box on googlecode page. There won't be many people seeing it anyway. No problem.
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